Damon Duva Deposition

APPEARANCES: TABLE OF CONTENTS ELIZABETH MARZOTTO TAYLOR Deborah L. Gordon, PLC 33 Bloomfield Hills Parkway Suite 220 Bloomfield Hills, Michigan 48304 248.258.2500 Emarzottotaylor@deborahgordonlaw.com Appearing remotely on behalf of the Plaintiff. TODD J. SHOUDY Fletcher Fealko Shoudy & Francis, P.C. 1411 Third Street Suite F Port Huron, Michigan 48060 810.987.8444 Tshoudy@fletcherfealko.com Appearing remotely on behalf of the Defendants. ALSO PRESENT (appearing remotely): Scott Jones 2 11 20 23 24 25

Macomb County, Michigan Thursday, April 3, 2025 11:02 a.m. WITNESS PAGE DAMON DUVA DAMON DUVA, was thereupon called as a witness herein, and after EXAMINATION having first been duly sworn to testify to the truth, BY MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR: 4 the whole truth and nothing but the truth, was examined and testified as follows: EXHIBITS EXAMINATION BY MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR: EXHIBIT PAGE

Okay. Good morning. Exhibits not offered.

Good morning.

My name is Elizabeth. I represent Scott Jones. I'm going to be asking you a series of questions today. If you don't understand me, or if you'd like me to repeat or rephrase, just let me know.

Okay.

So, I'm just going to have you just go ahead and state your full name for the record.

My name is Damon Duva.

Okay. And you're currently employed with the St. Clair County sheriff's office as a deputy?

That's correct.

Okay. How long have you held that job? 4 2 5 8 10 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

Twenty-five years.

Okay. In your time, you know, that you've been employed by the sheriff's office, have you held any job title other than deputy?

I worked at the drug taskforce for a while. All that is still is as a deputy. I'm right now assigned to the secondary road patrol, which is still a deputy position. So, I guess just always a deputy.

And before you worked for St. Clair County, where were you employed?

I worked at Oakland County sheriff's office as a corrections deputy. And I worked at Capac police department as a police officer.

Let's start with Oakland county corrections department. What were the years that you worked there?

'99 to 2000 era. I was there for maybe six to eight months total.

Why did you leave there?

I got hired in at St. Clair County sheriff's office.

And then you said there was another police department that you worked for?

Yeah, a small department in our county. It's called Capac PD or Capac city police department. I worked there part-time while I was at the other place,

corrections facility.

Okay. So you worked -- you said it's called Capac?

Yeah.

What does that stand for?

C-a-p-a-c. It's just a town.

Can you spell it.

C-a-p-a-c.

Okay. And you said you worked as a part-time police officer there?

Yep.

Okay. What were the years that you worked at Capac?

Same thing, '99 to 2000. I was only there six to eight months. I took that job to get a certification to be a policeman. So, that's why I took it.

Why did you leave there?

Just no money and no full-time and just I obviously wanted to find a better department.

What's your educational background?

I have a bachelor's of science degree from Ferris State University.

Okay. When did you get that degree?

I graduated in '99.

How long have you known Marcus King?

I've known Marc King 15, 20 years.

How did you first come to meet him?

I knew his brother from working with him. And then Marc got hired on in our department and was in our jail for a while, and met through them. Just through work is how I met him.

Okay. And you and Marc have been friends for quite some time, right?

Yep.

And you socialize with Marc outside of work?

I do.

Okay. How regularly do you guys get together for, you know, meals or events or other activities?

Probably every couple weeks.

Okay. When would be the last time that you, you know, met with him in a social capacity? The last time you hung out?

Probably two to three weeks ago.

Okay. What were you doing?

I am just trying to remember here.

Sure. Go ahead. Take your time.

I think he stopped over for dinner at the house.

Was your wife there?

Yep.

And you call and text with Marcus?

I do.

How frequently do you call and text with him?

I talk with him probably every couple days. You know, sometimes more; sometimes less.

And you're talking about work activities as well as non-work topics?

Correct.

Were you calling and texting with him in the November of 2022 timeframe?

Was I friends with him in November, is that what you're saying?

Yeah. You had the same kind of relationship in that timeframe as you just described?

Nothing has changed, correct.

Okay. Did you call or text with Marcus about his OWI arrest in 2022?

I spoke with Marcus. I did not text him the night of his OWI arrest. No, I did not.

Not the night of, but you texted him in the November timeframe about the arrest?

After the arrest, ma'am?

Sure.

Sure.

Yeah. And do you still have those texts?

I do not.

Okay. Why don't you have them?

I think I switched carriers. It's been three years.

I think I switched carriers on my phone and I've gotten rid of most of them.

Did you delete the texts?

I'm sure I've deleted some, yeah.

Do you remember when you would have deleted them?

I don't.

Okay. What was the carrier that you had in November of 2022?

I think Verizon.

And what's the carrier you have now?

I have Visible Verizon.

Visible Verizon?

Uh-huh.

And are those the only two carriers that you've had, you know, between November '22 and now?

I believe so, yes.

Okay. I am going to ask for -- well, let me ask you this first: Do you have a work phone?

I do.

Okay. Do you know the carrier of your work phone?

Yep. It's Verizon.

Okay.

Well, no. I have no idea what the carrier is, to be honest with you.

You don't know who the carrier is for your work phone?

No. I'm sure the department knows. I don't know who the carrier is.

Did you have a work phone in November of 2022?

I did.

Okay. Were you calling and texting with Marcus King on your work phone in November of '22?

I was not.

Okay. So, all of your an communications with Marc King were on your personal cell phone?

Correct.

I am going to ask for the cell phone number that you used to communicate with them. But I can take that off the record. (Off the record at 11:10 a.m.) (Back on the record at 11:10 a.m.) MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR: Back on the record. BY MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR:

How long have you known Mat King?

I've known Mat King for probably around 20 years or more.

And how did you first meet Mat King?

Just at work.

At work. And you and Mat have been friends also for a long time, right?

We were acquaintances. We're friends, sure. But Marc

and I's relationship would be more than Mat and I's

How often -- how many times a week do you see the relationship. sheriff?

That's fair enough. But you and Mat socialize outside

Sometimes -- I would say once every possibly two of work from time to time, right? months. I don't report to the office. I don't see

Yeah. We were partners for a while in the car. So we the sheriff. have some history together.

You don't remember report to the office?

And you, from time to time, will get together with Mat

No. for meals, activities, and the like, right?

Where do you report?

Correct.

I take my car home. I start from my residence.

And you also call and text with Mat King, correct?

So, when you start a shift, for example, you don't

Not -- no, not really. I have. But I don't text -- necessarily come into the office, you just get in your like you're saying as on a friend level, not really. car and start your shift at the appointed time?

Okay. Have you ever?

Check in with the radio, check in with my supervisor

Sure. on duty, and go do what I do.

Okay. And you stay in pretty close touch with him

But you don't -- at the end of the shift, do you given the working relationship that you all have? report to the office?

Say that question one more time, please.

No.

Yeah. Do you stay in close touch with Mat King given

Okay. So you're never going into the office? that, you know, you've worked with him for a long time

I'm not saying never. You asked me how many times do and he's now your boss? I see Mat King. I'll tell you maybe once every two

As far as work and stuff, just as a boss employee. I months. don't see him. I don't talk to him very much at all.

Yeah. And now I've kind of moved on to some other You don't usually talk to the sheriff, so. questions about how your daily duties roll.

It's a pretty small office, right? But I want to make sure we have a clear

I'd say it's pretty good size, sure. record. So, when I'm asking a question, just go ahead

and let me finish the question so that you know what you're answering and that our court reporter can make a clean record, okay? So, as of November 2022, what was the shift that you were working?

6A to 6P.

Okay. So, in November of 2022, when you were ready to start your shift at 6:00 a.m., did you report into the office?

Is November 22 the date of the incident is what we're talking about?

Yeah. MR. SHOUDY: I think she's saying November of 2022 is what she's saying.

Can you rephrase the question. I'm sorry. BY MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR:

Sure. So, I asked you in November of 2022 what shift you were working. You said 6 a.m. to 6 p.m.?

Correct.

My question is in November of 2022, when you were ready to start your shift, did you report into the office or did you just start your shift from your residence?

Start from my residence.

And then also in November of 2022, when you were done

with your shift, did you report into the office to Mat King in November 2 your personal phone? close out your shift, or did you just go home?

It all depends. I mean, throughout my shift, I

Personal phone. sometimes go to the office. You know, it's not like -- you know, sometimes I go to briefing. Sometimes I with the sheriff? don't. It just all depends. There is no set way of

No. doing it. But I usually start from my house and

Is there a reason for that? finish from my house.

I never use my work phone.

Okay. So, what are the circumstances that would bring

Is there a reason for that? you back into the office kind of on a, you know,

I just never use my work phone. case-by-case basis as you just described? Give me

Okay. Are you like trying to not make a record of some examples. You said a briefing might be one. your communications for work? Or why don't you use What else? it?

The bathroom, me to use the bathroom. Any type of supplies that you'd need for your duties. You know, papers, pencils, you know, stuff for the car, always use my regular phone. paperwork that would need to be turned in. Any type

Okay. So, you're texting and calling with Mat, the of new equipment. Maybe if the boss called you. I sheriff, on your personal phone? mean, I could go on and on. All types of police

Uh-huh. activity. How's that?

Do you still have records of those calls and text

I think we have some examples here -- messages that you would have exchanged with him in

Yeah. November of 2022?

-- that I can understand. Let's see here. So, going back to your four phones in the last -- I'm pretty hard on my relationship with Mat King, did you text and call with

So, you were not using your work phone to communicate

No. I just never do. I have trouble keeping this one going, you know, as far as to work two phones. I just

I doubt it, no. I probably have gone through three or phones. So, there has been a lot of, you know, cases of 2022 with your work phone or

where the phones have been busted too.

What's her name?

Have you deleted call logs or text messages reflecting

Carrie Duva. communications between yourself and the sheriff in

And how long has Carrie been with the sheriff's November of 2022? office?

Oh, I'm -- hang on. There is something that came up

I think she got hired in in 2007 until now. on the computer here. Okay, we're back on.

What's her current job title? MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR: Madame Court

She's a deputy sheriff. Reporter, would you please read back my last question.

And has she always held that role? (The following portion of the record was

She has. read by the reporter at 11:18 a.m.:

And she's friendly with Marcus King's wife, right?

"Have you deleted call logs or text

She is. messages reflecting communications between

And is she also friendly with Mat King's wife? yourself and the sheriff in November of

She is. 2022?")

And you and your wife -- you know, we've kind of

I'm sure I have, yes. covered this already 16 socialize with Marc and his wife, correct? BY MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR:

Okay. Do you remember when you would have deleted

We have, yes. those?

I don't. to time, with Mat King and his wife, right?

Is it possible you would have deleted them in the last

We have, yes. six months to a year?

Have you been deposed before?

No. They would have been longer than that.

Yes.

And your wife is also a St. Clair County deputy,

How many times? right?

I don't know the exact number. I can give you over

Yes, ma'am. three.

And you and your wife will also socialize, from time -- but you and your wife will

More than three?

Yep.

More than five?

I don't know, ma'am. I can't remember, to be honest with you, how many times I've been deposed.

Okay.

I'm sure that's information you could probably find though.

The more than three times that you're thinking of, is that in your role as a sheriff's deputy or in a personal capacity?

Always in a role as a sheriff deputy.

Okay. And you were involved in or named as a defendant in a case involving the estate of a plaintiff Kirby. Do you recall that case?

I do.

And that involved you and some other sheriff's deputies opening fire on a plaintiff during a traffic stop, which led to his death?

Correct.

Am I correct that that case resulted in a settlement of about $900,000?

I don't know the exact amount, to be honest with you. I don't know.

But that sounds family?

I don't think it was that much, but I don't know the exact amount. I mean, Mr. Shoudy would be able to tell you.

If that's what the court records say, are you disputing that amount?

I'm not going to dispute it, no. You're asking my opinion. I don't know the amount.

You don't remember the amount?

No.

Did you receive any discipline for your actions in that case?

I did not.

And do you remember being named as a defendant in a case involving a plaintiff named Boco (phonetic)?

No. I mean, I guess I would need some more.

Sure. As far as I can see on, you know, pay serve court records, that was also the case where it was alleged that you used excessive force against a subject. Does that ring any bells?

Do you have a location or anything?

I don't have that written down. But I believe it involved you -- it was alleged that you used excessive force leading to the subject, I guess, I think being pushed to the ground and hitting his head or something like that.

I don't remember that last name. I'm not saying it -- I just would need more. I don't recall.

You're not disputing it, you just don't remember?

Correct.

Okay. How many times have you been accused of excessive force by residents?

Three.

Okay.

I'm guessing three.

What are the three times that you can think of?

Well, obviously the two that you are telling me about. And there he is another one with a subject named Jawaun (phonetic) Boyd.

What happened in that case?

It was a drug raid that took place and he got injured on a drug raid.

Okay. And what was your alleged involvement there?

Well, he ran up the stairs. We ended up taking him into custody and tackled him, and he got hurt during the tackles.

Did he file a lawsuit?

I believe he did, yep.

Was that case settled?

I believe it was.

Do you remember the amount?

That I don't know.

Okay. So, with regard to the case involving the subject that, you know, fell to the floor and hit his head, and Mr. Boyd, did you receive discipline for your involvement in either of those incidents?

I don't believe so, no.

Okay.

Without checking my -- you know, I'll be honest, they put stuff in our records. There could be some type of counseling memo or written. To my knowledge, I don't remember that happening. But that's something they could check my file on.

Okay. Let me just exhaust your memory on this. So, going back to the Kirby matter, did you receive verbal counseling with regard to your actions in that incident?

No.

And did you receive any written write-up that you can recall?

No.

Any suspension that you can recall of your employment?

We were suspended with pay until the investigation was over.

Sure. I'm talking about a disciplinary suspension?

No.

So, with regard to Boyd, did you receive verbal

Somewhere in that group, yeah. counseling for your involvement?

Have you ever received discipline during your

I don't believe so, no. employment?

Okay. Any written write-up that you recall?

I have a counseling memo that I got for a traffic

I don't believe so, no. citation that got accidentally given to the wrong

Any suspension? person via our computer system.

No.

And then for the Boco case, I know you said your wrong driver? memory is kind of hazy on that. I'm going to ask you

So, I entered the vehicle into our computer system, anyway to make my record. With regard to that case, and it automatically 14 write-up, but I think it's a verbal counseling or a or that allegation of excessive force, do you recall getting any verbal counseling?

No.

Any written write-up?

No. counseling memo on it.

Any suspension?

And what was alleged 18 check the ticket so that that person, you know,

No.

Has your employment with the department, or the office rather, has your employment ever been terminated? wouldn't have got the citation.

No.

And when did you receive that verbal counseling?

Do you remember approximately what the year was on the

Last year, two years 22 Q. And who gave you that verbal? Boyd case?

I don't. I can give you I was out at the task force

Sergeant Schwartzkopf. from 2002 to 2006.

So, somewhere in that timeframe? time?

And so by that you mean a citation was issued to the person that got the citation was the registered owner. However, the driver was not the registered owner. So, I call it a technical issue. But I did get a -- not a

I guess I didn't take the proper procedures to double

And was Sergeant Schwartzkopf your supervisor at the generates the citation. The that you did wrong there? ago.

He was.

I talked to him about when the time was and where I

Any other discipline that you've received? was going to get it done.

No, ma'am.

Okay. Did you talk to him about what you might be

No other discipline you can recall in the 25 years asked? you've worked there?

That was the first thing I ever got was from Sergeant talk to him about what might be asked? Schwartzkopf. I wasn't happy about it, due to the

Yes. fact it was a typo, and I write about a hundred tickets a month. So, people make mistakes. can't really talk about it.

So, that stuck in your mind as the first time you'd been disciplined in your 25 years? your testimony might 12 be?

Yes.

What did you do to get ready for your deposition

No. today?

Okay. Did you look at any other documents?

Took a shower and came in here.

Literally just my supplement. I didn't read the

Okay. Did you look at any documents to get ready? report. I didn't look at any car videos. I didn't

Sure. My report, my supplemental report. look at anything.

When did you look at your supplemental report?

Okay. Did you talk to anybody else to get ready to

I think I got it yesterday from management and I give testimony today? looked at it today.

I talked to my attorney, Mr. Shoudy.

Who from management gave it to you?

Other than Mr. Shoudy, anybody else?

I had to go up and get it from the captain because it's up there. So, that's where I got it from.

Okay. Did you talk to the captain about your good luck. deposition?

Did you talk to Marcus?

Did he talk to me about what might be asked or did I

No, we didn't talk about it. I mean, we both knew you

Was there any discussion at all about, you know, what

My wife knew what I was doing today. But that's about it. And we didn't talk about the case. She just said be or what the questions might

I did not. I mean, have we talked about it, yes. But I didn't talk about it with him today.

I understand you didn't talk today, but you and Marcus have discussed the fact that you've been, you know, noticed for a deposition and that you would be giving testimony?

Yeah, I have.

What did that conversation entail?

I basically said to him hey, thank you for dragging me through your shit that you did. I appreciate this.

Okay. And what did he say?

You know, what's he going to say. Okay, it happened. We have that kind of humor, if you will.

Yeah, I kind of grasped that from the way you said it. Did you talk about, you know, what you might be asked?

I mean, we kind of figured what we knew we were going to be asked.

I mean, I understand you kind of figured, but did you discuss it with him?

No.

Did you talk about how you might answer questions or what you might say about, you know, the events?

No.

Did you talk to the sheriff about your testimony?

When I went up to get the paperwork from the captain, he advised that he had just gone and did his. But we didn't talk about what went down with his, or what went down with Captain Pohl's, or anything like that. Just that hey, you're going to be there a while, and that was it.

And you learned that Captain Pohl had been deposed as well?

Correct.

Okay. How did you learn that?

He told me.

When did he tell you that?

When he gave me the report.

Okay. What did you guys talk about with regard to his deposition?

Nothing.

Well, obviously something because there was some -- you learned some information about it. So, what was that about?

He said that I got deposed and I was there for six hours. That's about what we got done. And then Mat said the same thing.

And Mat said the same thing?

Uh-huh.

Did you talk about what either of them had testified

to?

No.

Did you ever read their deposition transcripts?

No.

Were you asked to produce documents in this case?

No.

No one asked you to, you know, go through your records and look for relevant documents or records you might have about -- you know, that are relevant to the allegations here?

I guess I don't understand what you're saying there.

I'm asking if anyone ever asked you to go through your records and look to see if you had any documents that were pertinent to this case?

No. MR. SHOUDY: Just for the record, Elizabeth, one thing I was given yesterday, which will be sent to you here shortly, is a printout from Lapeer that he provided me, which I have on my list of things to send to you. If you need it for this depo, I'll go ask my secretary to e-mail it to you right now. I just asked her to scan it this morning. MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR: Yeah, if you wouldn't mind doing that, I'd appreciate it. MR. SHOUDY: Okay. If you -- I don't know

how long you're going to go, but if you want me to do it during a break, I can. MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR: Well, let me just ask the witness a couple questions about the document that you're referring to. BY MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR:

So, you know, you heard Mr. Shoudy make reference to a document from Lapeer county?

Sure.

Okay. Is that a document that you provided him?

Correct.

Can you describe the document.

Yeah. When I went and picked Mr. King or Marc up at the Lapeer county jail, they gave me a booking card with his information on it.

Okay. And you said you received that in the early morning of November 6 of 2022?

Yes, correct.

When you went and picked him up from Lapeer?

Yes.

And where has that document resided between when you received it and, you know, when you gave it to Mr. Shoudy?

Probably in my patrol car.

Where in your patrol car?

In my files.

Can you describe that for me.

Yeah. I have an accordion style, you know, folder that I keep my stuff in.

What kind of stuff do you keep in there?

Notes on cases, paperwork for, you know, other stuff that's taken place. You know, any type of police paperwork that we would have that we would have to fill out or something of that nature.

Okay. And so the booking card from Lapeer has been in that accordion file since November of '22?

Correct.

And when did you give to it Mr. Shoudy?

Yesterday. We had deposition prep yesterday, and I brought whatever I had, so.

Did you give him any other documents?

That was it.

Okay. Did you look through the accordion file in your car for anything else that might be relevant to the events of November 6?

There was nothing in there besides that.

Okay. Did you give Mr. Shoudy any other documents?

No. MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR: So, why don't we just take like a five-minute break and you can send me that

document before I get into my next line of questions. MR. SHOUDY: That's fine. (Off the record at 11:35 a.m.) (Back on the record at 11:46 a.m.) MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR: All right. Back on the record. BY MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR:

So, Deputy Duva -- well, I guess I'll just ask you this: Do you recall that Marcus King was arrested for OWI on November 6 of 2022?

Correct.

And it was in the early morning hours. So, you know, night of November 5th, early morning of November 6th. And you were involved in the arrest, right?

I was not involved with the arrest.

Okay. But you played some role, right?

I played a role, but I was not involved in the arrest.

Okay. What was the role that you played?

I went and picked Marc King up from Lapeer County jail and brought him back to St. Clair County jail.

Do you recall learning what Marcus's PBT results were upon his arrest?

Which part of his arrest, ma'am?

Well, the scores were the same on the scene and when he got to Lapeer County. So, I guess it doesn't

matter. So, do you recall learning what the results of the PBT test were?

When I picked him up I had no idea what his PBT results were. And then I believe I did see that he had blown an 18, or something of that nature.

Okay. How did you learn that information?

I really don't remember if it was on the sheet, or somebody advised me during the conversations that I had prior. But I don't recall how I found out.

Okay. What's the sheet you're referring to?

The booking sheet. I don't even know if it was on there.

And is the booking sheet the document that you gave your counsel yesterday?

Correct.

Okay. So, if the PBT results do not appear on the booking sheet --

Yep, I see that right now. I'm looking at it. It's not on here.

So, I'm going to ask that you don't look at any documents, unless I ask you to.

Okay.

Because, you know, you're not permitted to have any, you know, assistance or look at any documents while I'm asking you questions.

MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR: So, Todd, I'm just going to ask that, you know, nothing is in front of this witness while I'm asking him questions. MR. SHOUDY: Yeah, nothing has been in front of him. So, if you want him to look at document, let us know. MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR: Okay. I will do that. BY MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR:

So, if the PBT results do not appear on the, I'm going to call it the booking sheet that you gave to your counsel yesterday, how would you have learned that information?

I had talked to -- I don't recall how I got the information. But I had talked to Lieutenant Jones there and I had talked to Sheriff King prior. And I believe it might have been brought up in one of those two conversations.

You also talked to Marcus King, I assume, about the circumstances of the arrest?

I did, yes.

Possible you learned about it from him?

I don't think so because I don't think he knew.

You don't think he knew what his PBT results were?

I don't think so. Not the time when I picked him up.

Did you discuss the PBT results after you picked him up, with Marcus? So, at any time after you picked him up, did you and Marcus ever discuss the PBT results, what the number was?

I'm sure we did.

Okay. And you also talked to Deputy Pokriefka in the early morning of November 6, correct?

That's correct.

And he knew what the PBT results were, correct?

It's possible he could have told me too. I just don't remember how I found out.

I understand. I'm just trying to get the possible list of sources here.

Sure.

And the score, the 0.183, that's a very high score, correct?

It's a high BAC, yeah.

And in fact, it's so high that that can result in enhanced criminal penalties, right?

Are you referring to like a super drunk charge?

I am.

Okay. Yes.

Did you ever discuss that with Marcus?

I did not.

So, how did you first learn that Marcus had been

arrested?

I got a call from Phil Pokriefka.

Okay. When did you get that call?

Like 2:30, 3:00 in the morning, something of that nature.

Okay. And what did he tell you?

I was at my house sleeping.

And what did he tell you?

He called up and said that Marc had gotten arrested for drunk driving and that he was going to Lapeer County jail. And Phil is part of the union. He's a union vice president. And I was the president at the time. So, that's why he was calling me.

Okay. Let me ask you about your role with the union. In November of 2022, you were the union president you said?

I was.

Okay. And how long did you hold the role of union president?

Two, three, years. I really don't even know how long.

Do you remember the range of years that you held the position?

I was in the union for 13 and a half years in some type of capacity. As far as the -- two, three years, something like that.

I understand that. I want to know if you remember the actual years that you were the president?

2022, 2023, and I think 2021. But I don't know -- you know, those might not be full years.

I understand. But '21 to '23 timeframe is the range we're talking about when you were the union president?

Correct.

Okay. And before that, did you hold any other role in the union other than as a union member?

I was the vice president for I think a year, year and a half. And then I was the secretary and I was the treasurer.

Okay. You said you were the vice president for about a year. Was that immediately prior to you becoming the president?

It was.

And how long where you the secretary?

Some years. I don't know. I'll give you at least two and a half, three years. It could be more. It could be less.

Your best guess.

That's my best guess.

Understood. And was that immediately prior to you becoming the vice president?

Correct.

Okay. And how long were you the treasurer?

Same thing. About three years I think.

Okay. And did you hold the treasurer role immediately before you were the secretary?

I did.

So, treasurer, secretary, vice president, president was, you know, a trajectory?

That's correct.

Okay. And in your role as union president, what were your duties with regard to the union?

What were my union duties?

Yes.

If somebody -- I was a direct link to our union being POAM or a union rep that was assigned to us. I assisted in helping deputies if they had complaints. Filing stuff with the department in regard to grievances or issues. If there was a deputy that was hurt, we would assist them as far as financial or what we could do as a board. We had support groups set up. If there were deputies that were at need, you know, we would assist them. Just kind of all aspects of that.

Okay.

If you have a specific question, let me know.

Yeah, my specific question was what your duties were. And I think you gave me the list of what you can

recall. You said you were the link to POAM. What do you mean by that?

Well, if we had something that we needed to use the union for at the department, like I would be the one that would contact them or contact, you know, our union rep, if we needed it. If somebody had done something, you know, we would contact them.

What do you mean if someone had done something?

If there was discipline. If there was a grievance. If there was something that needed to be handled with union with management, they would be like our liaison.

So, you would then reach out to POAM to assist with whatever was going on with the officer?

Correct.

And then the POAM would step in and represent the officer?

Give us information. Help the officer out, whatever. Give us counsel.

Okay. So, why did Pokriefka call you to tell you that Marcus King had been arrested?

He called me because he wasn't sure why he went to Lapeer County and was wondering why we couldn't sit with Marc during the drunk driving.

Okay. The union doesn't play any role in an arrest if

the deputy is arrested? The union has no formal role in that process, correct?

As far as the arrest?

Yeah.

Yeah, not -- once the arrest is over, they have some stuff. But during the arrest, no.

Okay. And there is nothing in the collective bargaining agreement that gives deputies any, you know, any special rights or privileges with regard to an arrest, correct? Nothing that you know of?

Can you rephrase the question. I don't understand what you're saying.

Sure. Let me ask a prefatory question first. You were the president of the union in November of 2022?

Uh-huh.

Were you familiar with the union contract that was in place at that time?

I was familiar with it, sure. Did I know it completely, no.

Right. But you were familiar with its contents because you were the union president?

Correct.

So, as far as you know, being the union president, nothing in the union contract, that you can think of sitting here today, giving deputies any special rights

or privileges in the event that they are arrested?

No. It was kind of an unwritten rule that we had with management.

Nothing in the union contract though, right?

Nothing in the union contract, right.

So you get the call from Pokriefka. He tells you that he's been arrested and taken to Lapeer County jail. Did Pokriefka tell you anything else?

That's all he had known.

Okay. And what did you do next?

I said okay. I says is there any reason we can't sit with him. He says well, I don't know. I said all right, who is the on-duty supervisor. And he said it was Lieutenant Jones. So, I made a call to Lieutenant Jones.

Okay. And about what time did you call Jones?

It would have been 3 in the morning, 2:30, 3:00 in the morning when I got the call. It was within a minute or two of that.

How long was your conversation with Pokriefka?

Two, three, four, minutes.

And how did Pokriefka get the information about Marcus getting arrested?

I think he got the information from Deputy Schoof.

And Schoof was one of the officers at the scene

involved in making the arrest?

Correct.

Did you ever learn that Marcus King had called Pokriefka and told him that he had been arrested?

No, I never knew that.

So, you called Jones. The conversation with Jones, what did that entail?

I said Scott, I heard Marc got picked up for drunk driving. He said he did. He goes yeah, he's in Lapeer County jail. I asked him why he's in Lapeer County jail. And he said something in regards to like nepotism with his brother is what I assumed. And I said is there any reason we can't go pick him up. And I believe I asked him if he had called management. And he said he didn't get ahold of them. So, I said okay.

Okay. And that was the end of the conversation?

Yep.

And then what do you do next?

I knew I wasn't getting anywhere with Lieutenant Jones. So I made contact with Captain Pohl. And then I had made contact with Undersheriff Spedafore. And then I made contact with Sheriff King.

So, you wanted to go get Marcus out of Lapeer?

I did.

So, you said that your first call was to -- after speaking to Jones, your first call was to who?

Captain Pohl.

Did you talk to him?

No.

Okay. So, you called but he didn't pick up?

Correct.

And you left a voicemail?

No.

Okay. After Pohl didn't pick up, then you call who?

Spedafore, chain of command.

Okay. Fair enough. And did Spedafore pick up?

Nope.

Did you leave him a voicemail?

I did not.

And what's your next call?

And then I called the sheriff.

About what time do you think you called the sheriff?

From the time -- I don't know the exact time, but from the time Phil Pokriefka called, until the time I talked to Jones and probably made contact with the sheriff was all within about 15 to 20 minutes.

Okay. So, you call the sheriff?

He doesn't answer.

I'm sorry.

He doesn't answer.

The first time you called him, he didn't answer?

Correct.

Did you call him back?

No. He had called me back.

Okay. Did you leave him a voicemail when you called?

I did not.

Okay. So, he called you back. How long do you think between when you called him to when he called you back?

Maybe five minutes or so, maybe ten. I don't know exactly. A short time.

So, he calls you back. What do you say?

He calls me back. He goes what's going on. Because obviously I'm calling him at 3 or 3:30 in the morning. So, he knows that something is obviously going on. I said hey, Marc got arrested for drunk driving. I says he's down in Lapeer County jail. I go is there any way that I can go down and reference the union and sit with him until he sobers up. I go I'm not sure why he's in Lapeer County jail. And he goes well, this is the first I've heard of it. Let me make a call and I'll call you back.

Did he tell you who he was going to call?

I had told him I talked to, I think, Jones. And so

I'm assuming he knew. Because he knows his shift, who his lieutenant was at the time. So, I'm assuming he was going to call him.

So, you asked if you could go get Marc?

I did. I said is there any reason that we can't. And he said let me find out what's going on.

So, does he eventually call you back?

Yeah. He calls me back, I don't know, five, ten minutes later.

Did he tell you who he had spoken to?

He called me up and ad he said go ahead and pick him up and bring him back to the office. And I said okay. I'm assuming he talked to Jones. I don't remember if he specifically said I talked to Jones. I don't know.

Okay. Did he tell you anything about his conversation with Jones?

Our conversation was very short. No, he did not get into the dynamics of the conversation.

And you were not working that midnight shift that began, you know, midnight on the 6th?

I was not, no.

When did your next shift start?

I started as soon as the sheriff told me to go pick him up.

When was it supposed to start?

6:00 in the morning.

So, you said you started as soon as the sheriff told you to go and pick him up?

That's correct.

So it's, you know, 3, 3:30 a.m. at that point?

Somewhere around there. I'm not sure on the exact time, but that sounds about right.

Okay. And did you get paid for those hours between 3 and 6 a.m.?

I did.

And you got paid for the rest of your shift from, you know, 6:00 a.m. to 6 p.m. on November 6th?

I think I only worked a 12 hour. Like a 3 to 3. Whatever I came into I worked, I think, just a 12-hour shift. So, my shift started earlier.

So, let's say you started at 3. You said you would have worked 12 hours from whenever you began, right?

Yes.

And you got paid for that full 12-hour shift, right?

Correct.

And am I correct that you're paid through a state police grant?

I am.

And does that grant have certain reporting requirements that you're supposed to follow?

It does. But I also follow what the sheriff says as well.

Understood. But am I correct that with regard to the grant and, you know, with regard to the sheriff's department, there is a requirement that you fill out daily reports with your activities?

Is it required? I keep a log with the state of my traffic crashes and tickets. They don't see my daily logs, no.

But you do keep a daily log?

I do keep a daily log, sure.

And is that required by the sheriff's office or sheriff's department?

It is.

How many OWI arrests do you think you've done in 25 years?

I have no idea. A lot. I mean, I can't -- you want me to have a number. I have no idea, ma'am. I will give you more than a hundred. How's that.

More than a hundred. Fair enough. Are you doing OWI arrests on a weekly basis?

No.

On a monthly basis I assume?

Sometimes not even on a monthly basis. It all depends, you know.

But it's a regular part of your activities as a sheriff's deputy?

It's part of being a deputy sheriff, sure.

And going to jail is a standard consequence of being arrested for OWI, right?

Not necessarily a standard. I mean, there are so many different ways you can -- yeah, you can go and get your blood. You can go and get your breath. Yes, you can go to jail. You can be released. There is -- yeah, I mean there is more than just a cut dry thing.

I understand. I'm talking about someone who is stopped, pulled over, and has a breathalyzer test that is over the legal limit. So in that scenario, going to jail is a pretty standard consequence, correct?

Sure.

So, after you have your conversation with the sheriff, he tells you to pick him up, bring him back to the office, what is the next thing that happens with regard to your involvement in the incident?

I go down to Lapeer County jail and pick Marc up.

Okay. So you arrive at Lapeer County jail. What's the first thing you do?

I pull into the sally port.

What's the next thing you do?

I walk into the booking area of the jail.

Okay.

Well, his shoes and his jacket.

I talk to the on-duty supervisor that's down in the

Did he have personal effects, like a cell phone, jail. There is a sergeant. wallet, keys, that kind of thing?

Okay. Do you remember who that was?

I don't recall to be honest with you.

No idea.

Okay.

Okay. But do you have a specific recollection of

I don't know if he had his cell phone with him or not. talking to the on-duty sergeant? I don't know.

I do.

So, you don't know whether -- okay. Well, let me just

Okay. And what did that conversation entail? ask you this way: Did you take possession of Marcus

I basically just said I'm her to bring Marc King back King's personal effects upon, you know, going to get to St. Clair county. him from Lapeer County?

Okay. What did this sergeant say?

Well, once we got him out of the items -- or out of

He goes I figured. He goes it's kind of weird that the jail there, I can't remember if his cell phone was he'd be down here to begin with. with him or not is what I'm saying. I don't know. He

And was there any other discussion with the on-duty had a jacket and some shoes. You know, whatever was sergeant? on the booking card I'm sure would have been what

That was about it. would have been in his property. And I'm sure that

Okay. So, what's the next step in the process of the deputies that took him in would have had all of getting Marc King? that information as well. I don't know. I can't

One of the correction deputies goes and gets Marc out remember. of the cell. And they, you know, put his clothes on.

Was Marcus given back his property? It's a little different than our place. His stuff is

Was Marcus given back his property. At the jail? all right there. They put his stuff on, and gives me

Yeah. At Lapeer County jail. the booking card, and we leave.

Yes. I remember his shoes and his jacket. Yeah, he

What do you mean put his stuff on? put those on.

But you don't remember if he had a cell phone or a wallet that was given back to him?

I don't remember. I'm not saying he didn't. I'm just saying I, right now, don't remember.

Okay. So, I'm going to ask you this question: Do you have a specific recollection of taking possession of any of his personal effects like a cell phone or a wallet or keys?

I don't remember, that is what I'm saying.

You don't remember?

I don't remember.

Okay. Do you recall that Lapeer County had a hold on Marcus because his BAC was so high?

No. They never said that to me.

Okay. If I have a document from Lapeer County that reflects that there was a hold for a high BAC, you're not disputing that, are you?

No, they never said anything to me. But if you have a document that says that, I'm sure the document is legit.

So, you know, Marc puts his shoes and his jacket back on. What's the next thing that happens?

We go out to the patrol car.

Okay. And he's in the front seat with you?

Correct.

Did you have your dash cam on for the drive?

I did not.

Did you have your body cam on when you were interacting with him?

I did not.

How long did it take to get back to the office?

I'm trying to think. Lapeer is 58 miles I think, or something like that. I mean, I got on 69. I drove back to the Wadhams exit and got off. Took Ravenswood down to the office, if I remember right. But the time, I'm sure 45 minutes or something like that, 50 minutes. I mean, there wasn't much traffic obviously. It was early in the morning.

Right, yeah. So, your best guess, 45 to 50 minutes. And I assume there was conversation with Marcus in the car during the drive, correct?

Yeah. There wasn't a ton, but there was some.

What do you remember from that conversation?

Just that, you know, he was upset with himself. That, you know, he knew better. His wife, he was concerned about his wife obviously. We talked about that. And then I just consoled him and told him hey, hang in there. We'll get through this. You know, it sucks. But, you know, that is basically about it. We didn't get into what had really occurred as far as on the

stop or whatever. It seemed pretty self-explanatory.

Okay. When you were at the Lapeer County jail, did you see the cell that he was being held in?

I did.

Okay. Did you make any observations about the cell that he was being held in?

Yeah. It was a pretty shitty cell. I'll be honest with you. It was freezing in there. It had windows. I remember he was shivering real bad when I got there. He's like man, I'm freezing. And they wouldn't give him a blanket. And then his shoes and his stuff, like we would bag it up. They had it all in front of him, in front of his cell there. I just remember he was really, really cold.

Okay. Did you -- well, I'll follow up on that later. You said Marcus told you that they wouldn't -- that the Lapeer County jail refused to give him a blanket?

That's what he said. He was wanting another blanket.

Oh, so he had a blanket, but he wanted another one?

He had to sit on it. There was no benches. You just sat on the floor.

And he wasn't with -- you know, held with general population, right?

There was people all around him, yeah.

There were people in the cell?

Yes.

How many?

I don't recall to be honest with you. The jail goes like -- or the cells go on an L there. And there were people throughout the whole cell.

So, is it one cell with multiple people in it or --

I think there was a couple cells with multiple people in it.

So, no one was in the same cell with Marcus?

I don't recall. Because I walked up to the door. The corrections deputy had pulled him out. And he was coming out of the door. But the cell was back in still and it was dark obviously, because it was nighttime.

No other person in the cell with Marcus that you can recall sitting here today?

I can't say that. There could have been somebody else in the cell. I can't say that.

I understand that you think that hypothetically there could have been. But sitting here today, you don't remember seeing someone else in the cell with Marcus?

I remember that the corrections deputy pulled Marcus from the cell. There was a bunch of people in the cells. There was a bunch of clothes out in front of

the cell where he was standing. Meaning not just his clothes and shoes, but somebody else's. And I didn't see in the cell.

You didn't actually see inside the cell that Marcus was being held in?

It was a deep cell, correct.

So, you didn't see inside the cell that Marcus was being held in?

Correct.

Okay. So, if you didn't see inside the cell that Marcus was being held in. I'm going to re-ask you the same question that I asked you previously, which is sitting here today, you have no recollection of seeing another person in the cell with Marcus; is that right?

I saw the corrections deputy remove Marcus from the cell.

Sir, you're not answering my question. I'm asking you something really specific and I'm trying to get a straight-forward answer from you. So, I'll ask you again. Sitting here today, do you have a specific recollection of seeing another human being being held in the same cell with Marcus; yes or no?

I saw Marcus in the cell.

And no one else, correct?

I can't say that. I saw Marcus in the cell.

MR. SHOUDY: She's asking did you see any other person in the cell?

I didn't go in the cell. So, all I saw was him come out of the door. BY MS. MARZOTTO TAYLOR:

I'm not asking if you went in the cell, sir. I don't know why you're having difficulty telling me that there were no other people in the cell.

I'm not trying to be difficult. You're asking me could -- I feel like there was possibly some people in the cell. But I can't give you a for sure answer. You want me to say for sure nobody was in there. I am not for sure that somebody was not in there. I don't know that.

I'm asking you something different. So, just listen to my question, okay?

I've listened to it three times, but go ahead.

And you're not answering it, so I'm going to ask you again. Just try to listen. Sitting here today, do you have a specific recollection of seeing another person held in the same cell as Marcus?

No.

Okay. Thank you. So, during the drive home, is that when Marcus told you about the conditions that he was

held in at Lapeer?

I believe it's on 20th and Lapeer in the city of Port

Correct. Huron.

What else did you talk about on the drive home?

Did he tell you why he went to Tailgators that night?

He talked about how obviously he was embarrassed, and

To have a beer. how it happened, and how it went down, and he was

Okay. Was he meeting anyone there? concerned about his wife.

We didn't talk about that. I don't know who he was

What do you mean concerned about his wife? with even.

How she would feel that he got a drunk driving.

Did he tell you anything about what happened at the Obviously it was pretty traumatic. bar that night?

Understood. Did he tell you where his wife was that

Nope. night?

Did you ask?

No.

No.

You knew where his wife was that night though, right?

Did you ask him how much he had to drink?

I did.

I did not.

Yeah. His wife was at a bachelorette party for Mat

Did Marcus have a drinking problem? King's wife, right?

Not to my knowledge.

That's correct.

Would you, from time to time, go to Tailgators with

And your wife was also there, correct? Marc?

That's correct.

I've been at Tailgators. I don't remember going with

Did Marcus tell you how -- you know, anything about Marc to Tailgators. where he was before he was arrested?

Is that somewhere where people at the department go to

He said he was at Tailgators. socialize? Is that like a hangout for people who work

Okay. What's that? for the sheriff's office?

It's a bar.

I would say no.

Where is that located?

Do you remember Marcus telling you anything else on

the drive home?

Okay. And you said that, as far as you're aware,

No. Braun knew about the situation?

Okay. And did you update the sheriff when you got

He did know about the situation. back to the office?

And then you said you contacted the lieutenant and the

I did. I contacted the lieutenant when I left. And I sergeant when you arrived. Is that upon your arrival contacted the lieutenant and the sergeant when I with Marcus back to the office? arrived back. And then I believe they made contact

That's right. The, lieutenant would have been Braun, with the sheriff to let him know that he was here. the same person.

When you say you contacted the lieutenant when you

Who was the sergeant that you contacted? left, what are you referring to?

Zuzga. They were together in the same office. So,

Lieutenant Braun was coming on to duty. At the same they were contacted at the same time. time he would be my lieutenant. He was kind of aware

Understood. So, are you calling them on the phone? of the situation. Obviously Jones and Lieutenant

I did. Braun, they switch each other's shifts type of deal.

And what did you tell them? So, I'm sure he was getting briefed. I told Braun

Hey, I'm back with Marc. what I was doing so he knew what I was doing. Because

Okay. by the time I got back, he would have been on duty.

And they said we're in the DB.

So, when you say you contacted Braun when you left,

I'm sorry. Can you repeat that. You said hey, I'm when you left where? back with Marc.

My house.

I'm back with Marc. And they said yep, we're waiting

Okay. So you called Braun and said hey, I'm going to for you here in the detective bureau, which is the DB. pick up Marcus?

Got it. So, was it your idea to go back to the DB or

Yep. somebody else's?

Did you tell him where you were going after that?

It's just kind of standard practice. This has

He knew I was bringing him back to the office. happened before. That's what we've done.

So, was it your idea or somebody else's? created on November 6th, 2022, showing that he

I'll take responsibility. Yeah, it was my idea. actually remained in custody that night, or that

Okay. No one directed you to take him back to the DB? morning?

No. We all just kind of knew that's what was going to

There is no record you're saying? happen.

Yeah. I'm asking you whether you know of any records

You know, sir, respectfully, I'm not asking you what created on November 6th, the morning of November 6th, you knew. I'm just asking you -- upon your arrival, or at any other time on November --

Yes, it was my idea to take him to the detective

What kind of records would you be talking about? bureau.

Sir, if you could just let me finish so that we have a

And no one directed you to do that? clean record.

I can't remember if the sheriff said bring him back to

Sure. the office or not.

For our court reporter.

You said that earlier. I'm asking about the DB in There are no records created on November particular. 6th showing that Marcus remained in custody of your

That's where I took him. department?

That's where you took him, okay.

I did not do any records. And there was no booking card or any other

And there are no such records that you know of sitting record created upon your arrival back to the office here today? showing that he was, you know, in process or booked in

I can't answer that. I do not know. I know I did at your facility? not --

I never did, no.

I'm just asking you what you know of sitting here

And nothing that you're aware of, sitting here today? today. There are no such records that you know of

Nothing that I'm aware of, no. I don't know if the sitting here today? supervisors did something, but I did not.

I don't know of any records.

Okay. And in fact, there are no records that exist

Understood. Okay. So, you guys arrive back at the

office. What happens? What's the first thing you do?

Lieutenant Braun and Sergeant Zuzga are in the DB waiting for us. We bring him back in there. He sits down. And we sit there and watch him until he sobers up.

So, describe for me the DB.

It looks a lot like an attorney room. There is a nice big table with chairs around it. Probably eight to ten chairs. And then there is cubicles for each detective that's back there. Obviously it was the weekend. So, nobody is working back there. Marc sat in the second to the east chair of the wall of the detective bureau and sat there. I sat to the chair directly to the north of him.

So, when you arrive, Braun and Zuzga were in the room?

They were sitting in opposite chairs of us.

Was there a discussion at that time?

There was a discussion.

What did that entail?

Hey, we're going to keep you here until you sober up and you're free to go.

Who said that?

I believe one of the supervisors did. But I think it was common practice that everybody knew that's what was going to happen.

it. So, after you shut it, unless you have key to

I'm just asking who said what? open it, it stays locked.

I don't recall exactly who said it.

What time did you arrive with Marcus at the detective

And what did Marc say? bureau.

I think he said okay or he knew.

I would think probably around 4, 4:15-ish.

Okay. So, the area that you're describing with the

How many hours did you sit there with him? conference room, is that essentially in the same room

Until 9:00. as the cubicles that you described? There is no wall

You sat there the whole time? between the conference room area and the cubicles?

I did.

That's correct.

And he sat there the whole time?

Okay. And cubicles are open air. You know, do they

He did. have doors?

You never left the room at any time?

No doors.

I think I had Sergeant Zuzga come in because I had to

Okay. And are there computers and files and office use the restroom at one point. And he stayed with materials in the cubicles? him.

Everything you would need to run a detective bureau,

And Marcus, I assume, also left the room at some yes. point?

And there are, I'll call them, case files in the

I don't recall him leaving the room. cubicle area?

Never got up to use the restroom?

I'm assuming there probably was. I don't know.

I don't recall him leaving the room.

Okay. You said that you sat with Marcus. Was the

But it's possible that he did? door locked?

I don't recall him leaving the room.

I don't think the door -- I think the door

I heard you say that. But it's possible that he did? automatically locks. So, it probably was locked, yes.

Anything is possible.

How does the door automatically lock?

Including him getting up and leaving the room?

I think during the weekend you have a key to get in

I don't recall him leaving the room.

I heard you say that, sir. I'm asking you -- you know, you said you held him there for five hours. And it's possible that you -- and it's possible that he got up and left the room at some point during that five hours? You're not disputing that here today?

Sure.

Okay. Was he in handcuffs?

He was not.

And aside from you -- or maybe I think you said it was Zuzga coming in to relieve you at some point, was there anybody else in the detective bureau that morning?

Lieutenant Braun was there as well.

So, did Braun and Zuzga stay the entire five hours?

They would come and go. Usually one of them was with me in there for the amount.

Okay. I'm not sure I understand that. So you said they would come and go, and then you said that they stayed there with you.

Right. So, they have a shift to run. So, one would get out and maybe do some paperwork. Get their shift going with the other guys. One would stay with me. One would come back and check to see if we needed something. Back and forth. One would stay and talk.

Okay. And was there always -- were there always two of you in the room with Marc, or were you alone with him?

I would 90 percent of the time there was always two of us in there.